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The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath

 
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herald2




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PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2008 1:49 pm Post subject: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

A sign of The Antichrist is "...he thinks to change times and laws." Dan 7:25.  He, only, "thinks to change," because, no man/institution can overrule our Creator and change His law.  There is, only, one time in His Covenant - the Sabbath.

Catholic:  "Question.- Have you any other way of proving that the church has the power to institute festivals of precept?"
                 "Answer. - Had she not such power, she could not have done that in which all modern religionists agree with her, - she could not have substituted the observance of Sunday the first day of the week, for the observance of Saturday the seventh day, a change for which there is no Scriptural authority." - Rev. Stephen Keenan, A Doctrinal Catechism, p. 174.

Presbyterian:  "The Christian Sabbath (Sunday) is not in the Scripture, and was not by the primitive church called the Sabbath." - Dwight's theology, vol.4, p. 401.

Congregational:  "There is no command in the Bible requiring us to observe the first day of the week as the Christian Sabbath." - Fowler, Mode and Subjects of Baptism.

Lutheran:  "The observance of the Lord's day (Sunday) is founded not on any command of God, but on the authority of the church." - "Augsburg Confession of Faith," quoted in Cox's Sabbath Manual, p.287.

Episcopalian:  "The festival of Sunday, like all other festivals, was always only a human ordinance, and it was far from the intentions of the apostles to establish a divine command in this respect, far from them and from the early apostolic church, to transfer the laws of the Sabbath to Sunday." - Neander, The History of the Christian Religion and Church, p. 186.

Methodist:  "It is true there is no command for infant baptism...Nor is there any for keeping holy the first day of the week." - Rev. Amos Binney, Theological Compend, pp. 180, 182, 1902 ed.

Baptist:  Dr. Edward T. Hiscox, author of The Baptist Manual before a New York Ministers' Conference, held Nov 13. 1893, said, "There was and is a commandment to keep holy the Sabbath day, but that Sabbath day was not Sunday.  It will be said, and with some show of triumph, that the Sabbath was transferred from the seventh to the first day of the week, with all it's duties, privileges and sanctions.  Earnestly desiring information on this subject, which I have studied for many years, I ask, Where can the record of such a transaction be found?  Not in the New Testament, absolutely not. There is no Scriptural evidence of the change of the Sabbath institution from the seventh to the first day of the week."

"Of course," he continues, "I quite well know that Sunday did come into use in early Christian history as a religious day, as we learn from the Christian fathers and other sources.  But what a pity that it comes with the mark of Paganism, and christened with the name of the sun god, when adopted and sanctioned by the papal apostasy, and bequeathed as a sacred legacy to Protestantism!"

Our Creator instituted the Sabbath at Creation, as a part of the Creation Covenant with Adam, and so with all of mankind.  Jesus referred to Himself as the "Lord of the Sabbath." Mt 12:8; Mk 2:28; Lu 6:5. Sunday was called, "The Lord's Day," in sun worship, common in The Roman Empire.

To say, that, the Sabbath is obsolete is to reject the words of the Lord Jesus Christ, who prophesied, that, the Sabbath would be kept during The Great Tribulation: "But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day: for then shall be Great Tribulation such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, nor ever shall be." Mt 24:20,21.  And we are not there, yet.

When Jesus gave us the "Two Greatest Commandments," He was quoting the law.  Deut 6:5; Lev 19:18.  These two are a summation of The Ten:

If you love the Lord, supremely, you will not worship or bow down to other gods, take His name in vain, or, profane His holy day.

If you love your neighbor as yourself, you will honor your parents, do no murder, commit adultery, steal, bear false witness or covet.

"By this we know that we love the children of God (Greatest Commandment #2), when we love God (#1) and keep His commandments.  For this is love that we keep His commandments: and His commandments are not grievous." 1 John 5:2,3.

Not for those under The New Covenant, who have His Covenant engraved upon their hearts and minds.  Jer 31:31-34; Heb 8:10;10:12-17.  Born again believers are called, "The seed of Abraham." Ga 3:16,29.  "For he is not a Jew, who is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God." Rom 2:28,29.

"As far as the east is from the west, so far hath He removed our transgressions (of the law: 1 John 3:4) from us...To such as keep His Covenant and to those that remember His commandments to do them." Ps 103.

Covenants have conditions.

Jesus said, "If ye love Me, keep My commandments." John 14:15.

His church keeps His commandments:  "And the Dragon was wroth with the woman and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ." Rev 12:17.

His saints keep His commandments:  "Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus." Rev 14:12.

At the very end of the Book of all Books, the Apostle John wrote, "Blessed are they that do His commandments, that they may have RIGHT to the tree of life, AND MAY ENTER IN through the gates into the city." Rev 22:14.

There are Ten Commandments in His Covenant - not nine.  They are commandments and not requests.

"Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy." Ex 20:8.
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Walkernyranger




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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

I have asked this of you several times before, could you please answer?  How does going to church on Sunday, mean that it is my sabbath?  I can go to church any and everyday of the week.  It does not mean that I make it the sabbath.
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herald2




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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:53 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

The Lord said, "Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy." Ex 20:8. We honor our Creator by resting on the day, that, He rested - ?The, only, day, He blessed and sanctified. It is a question of obedience to His Word.

The Jews added hundreds of rules and regulations to the keeping of the Sabbath. ?Jesus did not defer to them, yet, He kept the law, perfectly.

How did Jesus keep the Sabbath? ?By worshiping the Father and meeting human need.

Isaiah prophesied, that, God's people will keep the Sabbath in His kingdom:

"For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before Me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. ?And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before Me, saith the Lord." Isa 66:22,23.
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Walkernyranger




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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:20 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

That is not what I asked you.  I asked you how does going to church on Sunday mean that I am calling it the Sabbath.   Are we to ONLY worship God on Saturday?  Is it wrong to worship God on Sunday?  Aren't we supposed to worship God everyday?  Morning by morning?  

Not that I agree with your conclusions,because I don't, but even according to your own points, all someone has to do to observe the sabbath is to not work and to worship God on Saturday..  So if someone goes to church on Sunday, has Saturday off, and worships God everyday, are they calling Sunday the sabbath?

So please answer me, how does going to church on Sunday, mean that I am calling Sunday the sabbath?
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herald2




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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:35 am Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

The Sabbath is sundown Friday to sundown Saturday. ?We are to rest on the Sabbath. ?We can worship Him every day, but, He commanded us to keep the Sabbath holy:

"If thou turn away thy foot from the Sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on My holy day: and call the Sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour Him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:

Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it." Isa 58:13,14.

Just as in the Garden, it is a question of allegiance...Is your allegiance to the Catholic/Protestant religious system, or to our Creator and His Word?
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Walkernyranger




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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:52 am Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

So then is your answer that as long as someone did not work from sundown on Friday to Sundown on Saturday and worshiped God every day of their life and then went to church on Sunday, than they would not be calling Sunday the sabbath?

If this is the case, than what is your issue?

Do you just want people to make sure they don't work on Friday night and Saturday day? ?A Christian should be presenting their bodies as living sacrifices everyday as a spiritual act of worship. ?

What does any of this have to do with what day I go to church? ?Do you only assemble with other believers on the sabbath? ?No midweek bible study, no youth group, no kids club, not prayer meeting?

These aren't rhetorical questions, I am curious to know.


Last edited by Walkernyranger on Tue Sep 16, 2008 3:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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herald2




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PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 1:50 am Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

Do you know what "The Everlasting Gospel" is that is to go to the whole earth?

"And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every kindred, tongue and people. ?Saying with a loud voice, Fear God and give glory to Him; for the hour of His judgment is come: and WORSHIP HIM THAT MADE HEAVEN, AND EARTH, AND THE SEA, AND THE FOUNTAINS OF WATERS." Rev 14:6,7.

He is calling us back to honor Him as our Creator, in keeping the Sabbath holy.

The Reformers studied Daniel and Revelation and pointed to the office of the Papacy as fulfilling Scriptures concerning The Antichrist. (Which also means, "False Christ.)

JOHN CALVIN: "I deny him to be the vicar of Christ, who, in furiously persecuting the gospel, demonstrates by his conduct that he is Antichrist--I deny him to be the successor of Peter...I deny him to be the head of the church." "Some persons think us too severe and censorious when we call the Roman pontiff Antichrist. ?But those who are of this opinion do not consider that they bring the same charge of presumption against Paul himself, after whom we speak and whose language we adopt...I shall briefly show that (Paul's words in 2 Thess 2) are not capable of any other interpretation than that which applies to the Papacy." John Calvin, Tracts, Vol. 1, pp. 219.220

MARTIN LUTHER:"nothing else than the kingdom of Babylon and of very Antichrist...For who is the man of sin, and the son of perdition, but he who by his teaching and his ordinances increases the sin and perdition of souls in the church; while he yet sits in the church, as if he were God? ?All these conditions have now for many ages been fulfilled by the papal tyranny." Martin Luther, First Principles, pp. 196-197.

JOHN WYCLIF: "Why is it necessary in unbelief to look for another Antichrist? Hence in the seventh chapter of Daniel, Antichrist is forcefully described by a horn arising in the time of the 4th kingdom. ?For it grew from (among) our powerful ones, more horrible, more cruel, and more greedy, because by reckoning the pagans and our Christians by name, a lesser (greater?) struggle for the temporals is not recorded in any preceding time...and the horn has arisen from the ten horns, having eyes and a mouth speaking great things against the Lofty One, and wearing out the saints of the Most High, and thinking that he is able to change times and laws." (Daniel 7:8.25 quoted)...For so our clergy foresee the lord pope, as it is said of the eighth blaspheming little head." Wyclif's De Veritate Sacrae Scripturae, vol. 3, pp. 262,263.

There are similar statements by John Wesley, William Tyndale, King James, John Knox, Philipp Melancthon and Huldreich Zwingli.

Many of the Reformers were martyred for such statements...they were not burned at the stake, but roasted at the stake.

Here are some claims that appear in the ecclesiastical (Roman Catholic) dictionary by Lucius Ferraris, entitled Prompta Bibliotheca Canonica, Vol. V1, pgs. 438,442, article, "Pope." The Catholic Encyclopedia, 1913 edition, Vol. V1. p. 48 speaks of this book as "a veritable encyclopedia of religious knowledge," and "a precious mine of information."

"The pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not a mere man, but as it were God and the vicar of God."

"He is likewise the divine monarch and supreme emperor and king of kings."

"Hence the pope is crowned with a triple crown, as king of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions."

"So that if it were possible that the angels might err in the faith, or might think contrary to the faith, they could be judged and excommunicated by the pope."

"The Pope is as it were God on earth, sole sovereign of the faithful of Christ, chief king of kings, having plenitude of power, to whom has been entrusted by the omnipotent God direction not only of the earthly, but also of the heavenly kingdom."

"The pope can modify divine law, since his power is not of man, but of God."

"We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty." - Pope Leo X111, in an Encyclical Letter, June 20, 1894.

"For thou art another God on earth." - History of the Councils, vol. X1V, p. 109.

"We define that the Holy apostolic see (the Vatican) and the Roman Pontiff hold the primacy over the whole world." - A Decree of the Council of Trent, The Most Holy Councils, vol.13, col. 1167.

"The pope is the supreme judge...He is the vicegerent of Christ, who is not only priest forever, but also king of kings and lord of lords." -Vatican Council, p. 220.

"The Pope is not only the representative of Jesus Christ, but he is Jesus Christ, himself, hidden under the veil of flesh." - The Catholic National, July, 1895.

During the Vatican Council of 1870, on January 9, it was proclaimed: "The Pope is Christ in office, Christ in jurisdiction and power...We bow down before thy voice, O Pius, as before the voice of Christ, the God of truth; in clinging to thee, we cling to Christ."

Rome says, "It's (Sunday's change for Saturday) THE MARK of our authority to overrule God's law." Father Enright, C.S.S.R., President of Redemptorist College, History of the Sabbath, p. 802.

"Sunday is our MARK of authority...The church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact." The Catholic Record, Sept 1, 1923.

"Of course the Catholic Church claims the change was her act...and the act is A MARK of her ecclesiastical power and authority in religious matters." Thomas, H.F., Chancellor of Cardinal Gibbons, in answer to a letter regarding the change of the Sabbath.

"Thus the priest may, in a certain manner, be called the Creator of his Creator, since by saying the words of the consecration, he creates as it were, Jesus,in the sacrament, by giving him a sacramental existence, and produces him as a victim to be offered to the eternal Father. ?As in creating the world it was sufficient for God to have said, let it be made and it was created. ?He spake and they were made, so it is sufficient for the priest to say, 'Hoc est corpus meum,; and behold the bread is no longer the bread, but the body of Jesus Christ. ?'The power of the priest,' says St. Bernadine of Sienna, 'is the power of the divine person; for the transubstantiation of thebread requires as much power as the creation of the world."

Do you hear the voice of The Usurper? ?I do.
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Walkernyranger




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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:25 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

So are you saying that because someone claims that Sunday worship is their mark of authority, that I ca not worship on that day?  Do they own Sunday or does God?  I certainly shouldn't follow anyone who believes these things, but everyday and everything belongs to the Lord and we are to worship Him everyday of the week.  The day we choose to gather as a body is unimportant and definitely shouldn't be hindered by some church led by the doctrine of demons says.

I just do not see your argument here.  The only part of your argument I can see is that one should not work on the Sabbath.  I see no correlation to gathering together with other believers on a certain day.  But as I stated we can meet any day of the week, and should be worshiping everyday.  What do I care if the Roman Catholic Church, who I do not even believe to be a Christian church, says on any subject?  Everyday belongs to the Lord, and no one can take that away from him.

If worshiping God on Sunday is the Mark of the Beast, what is not worshiping God on Sunday, a day He owns and created just like every other? No worship God everyday, including Sunday.
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herald2




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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 7:01 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

We should worship the Lord every day, but, He commanded us to keep the Sabbath holy.  The Jews added hundreds of rules and regulations to the keeping of the Sabbath, (tradition), Jesus did not defer to them, yet, He fulfilled the law, perfectly.

I worshiped on Sunday for decades, until, I heard the Sabbath taught from Genesis-Revelation.  Just as in the Garden, it is a question of allegiance.  Is our allegiance to the Catholic/Protestant religious system, which the Lord calls, "The Mother of harlots. "Rev 17? Or is it to our Creator and His Word?

A mark of The Antichrist is "...he thinks to change times and laws." Dan 7:25.  There is, only, one time in His Covenant - the Sabbath.

How did Jesus keep the Sabbath? By worshiping the Father and meeting human need.

Here is a great promise:
"If thou turn away thy foot from the Sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day: and call the Sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour Him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words.

Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: (Ga 3:7,29) for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it." Isa 58:13,14.

Did you know that, God's people will keep the Sabbath in His kingdom?
"For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before Me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before Me, saith the Lord." Isa 66:22,23.

Do you know what "The Everlasting Gospel" is?

"And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue and people.

Saying with a loud voce, Fear God, and give glory to Him; for the hour of His judgment is come: and worship Him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of water." Rev 14:6,7.

When we honor Him on the Sabbath, we honor Him as our Creator.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:08 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

So do you or do you not worship the Lord on Sunday?  You said we should worship everyday, but then you made it seem as if you no longer worship on Sunday.

My allegiance is to God and his word, but I do  not see how going to church on Sunday conflicts with observing the sabbath.  If we are worshiping him on Sunday anyway, then why would it be wrong to do it corporately?  Again the only thing that I can take from your arguments is that we should not stop observing the sabbath, so if anyone is working on the sabbath, they should stop.  But since we worship everyday, Sunday is no different, except you can also work on that day.  Please explain how this is not the case.

And if going to church on Sunday is the mark of the beast than many many Christians have obviously taken this mark at one time or another.  Even you have admitted to it, so are we all doomed?  Or can we reverse this by staying away from church on Sunday and only gathering on other days?
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herald2




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PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:40 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

I fellowship at church with other believers on the Sabbath, run a rest home ministry, and post on many websites.

What you do is between you and the Lord. ?Just use the Sabbath to worship the Father and meet human need, as Jesus did.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

I fellowship with other believers every day and with believers outside my own immediate family on Sunday morning, Sunday night, Wednesday night, Thursday night, and Saturday morning.  I have in the past also worshiped with others on Friday nights, Saturday nights, Tuesday nights, and probably a few other times.  The Sabbath is every day, it is Today.  Enter into his rest today.  The rest brought by Christ, not Moses or Joshua, which is only a picture of what was to come.  Therefore use everyday to worship the father and share his love with everyone.  And rest in the completed work of the Lord. (Hebrews 4)
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herald2




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PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:13 pm Post subject: Re: The Denominations Speak: The Sabbath Reply with quote

Our Creator said, "And on THE SEVENTH DAY God ended His work which He had made; and He rested on THE SEVENTH DAY from all His work which He had made. ?AND GOD BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY, AND SANCTIFIED IT: because that in it He had rested from all His work which God created and made." Gen 2:2,3.

When He repeats in Scripture, it is for emphasis.

Then, He made it part of His law:

"Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. ?Six days shalt thou labour and do all thy work: BUT THE SEVENTH DAY IS THE SABBATH of the Lord thy God...For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested THE SEVENTH DAY: wherefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day, and hallowed it." Ex 20:8-11.

In Shemitic, Hebrew, Targum, Ancient Syriac, Chaldee Syriac, Samaritan, Babylonian, Assyrian, Maltese, Ethipic, Tigre, Amharic, Falasha, Coptic, Orma, Tamashek, Berber, Hausa, Urdu, Pashto, Greek, Latin, Spanish, Portugese (over 100 languages) the word for Saturday is "Sabbath."

The fourth commandment is a commandment - not a request. ?To break it is to transgress His law.

"...for sin is the transgression of the law." 1 John 3:4.

"And being made perfect, He became the author of eternal salvation UNTO ALL THEM THAT OBEY HIM."  Heb 5:9.
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